Keeping bait alive

[BentRod]

This is a great presentation on keeping bait alive. No matter how good at keeping bait you think you may be, you can learn something from this. It is quite long, but well worth it when you have the time. Starts at about minute 15.

[Deleted]

Apr 28, 2014 6:08:59 GMT -5 BentRod said:

This is a great presentation on keeping bait alive. No matter how good at keeping bait you think you may be, you can learn something from this. It is quite long, but well worth it when you have the time. Starts at about minute 15.

Excellent stuff Bentrod. Thanks for sharing.

So... what are your thoughts now in terms of where to put the Venturi? Surface agitation versus residence time for degassing CO2.

No doubt, this guy is saying the closer to the top, the better. I believe his argument is the deeper in the well, the less O2 that can be produced. Thus less O2 with a higher residence time and less surface agitation is not better than more O2 and less residence time plus more surface agitation.

Your thoughts?

Some other sticking points:

• It's all about the rate of change (temp, pH, ammonia, etc.). The higher this delta, the quicker your bait will die. Small degrees of change are acceptable. For example, changing water outright can produce a rate of change that kills your bait. From dirty to clean is worse than just staying with dirty.
• CO2 is a bigger enemy than ammonia for shad
• And many many more!

[Brian]

Surely a biology grad student somewhere has done controlled tests on this and written a paper.

[Deleted]

This is the guy who is doing the research. And it seems he is the first to do it with shad because not only is he a scientist, he is a striper fisherman. My guess would be that keeping bait alive in a bait tank does not appeal to the National Science Foundation.

[Brian]

You expect me to watch the video before commenting? Aint nobody got time fo dat!

[Deleted]

For those interested in the cheap chemical that removes both chlorine and ammonia as referenced in the above video, here is a link:

www.firstcompkoipond.com/Koi-Care-Kennel/ChlorAm-X-p-301.html

If anyone was able to hear the references he mentioned, please share. I was engrossed in his discussion and I can't find the area on the video.  Bottom Line, I would like to find the table that provides the proper dosage of baking soda for any given pH in a variable amount of water.

More Notes:

Salts Needed:

• Regular NaCl - Dosage: 1 cup per 20 gallons - Purpose: To replenish salt loss created by stress
• Baking Soda - Dosage: ?Tablespoons - Purpose: To buffer the pH and to help buffer the blood of shad
• Gypsum - Dosage: ? - Purpose: To replenish calcium. May not be important in waters with a high calcium content.

Other:

• MAKE SURE TO KEEP THE TANK OPEN TO AIR! Or the CO2 will build up and kill them.
• Use coffee creamer as de-foaming agent. Use small amount or an oil layer will form. Same principle of using oil on nose to get rid of foam in beer when using tap.
• 60 degree water - 1 mongo per gallon; 80 degree water - 1 Mongo per 2 gallons
• Don't man handle the shad. Optimum catch per net <= 5. Big net fulls actually kill them quicker. Use holding tank and keep hands off the shad as much as possible.
• The cleaner and cooler the water you get your bait from, the easier they will be to keep alive.
• The problem with an open system like a live well is that you are not able to get the salts back into their system that they lose as a result of initial stress.

[BentRod]

I don't know about the surface agitation because I've never really tried it in a boat tank, but it could be good. I do have a dannco in my home tank right under the surface mainly so any dead shad won't clog the pump.

A lot of the stuff he mentions is related to long term storage. He's dead right on the big net fulls of shad. You might as well dump them back if you're going to try to keep them long term. Short term (1-2 days) no problem, but long term they'll never live after being beat up.

I think he's a little low on the salt. I like a little more...closer to 1 cup per 10 gal or more..but I like my bait shiny! But without a doubt salt is needed and works wonders.

Cleaner cooler water definitely helps make shad easier to keep, which is why you see me trying to get shad in numbers in February for my home tank. They're deep, poop free, and are very easy to keep. They'll live til starvation. For 1-2 day use, it doesn't really matter where you get them from.

[FishON]

That is the first time I have heard about using baking soda. I might have to give that a try. Have any of you guys ever tried using baking soda in your tank?

[Deleted]

Eureka on the reference.

www2.ca.uky.edu/wkrec/Wurtspage.htm

[Deleted]

Apr 30, 2014 18:04:30 GMT -5 BentRod said:

I don't know about the surface agitation because I've never really tried it in a boat tank, but it could be good. I do have a dannco in my home tank right under the surface mainly so any dead shad won't clog the pump.

A lot of the stuff he mentions is related to long term storage. He's dead right on the big net fulls of shad. You might as well dump them back if you're going to try to keep them long term. Short term (1-2 days) no problem, but long term they'll never live after being beat up.

I think he's a little low on the salt. I like a little more...closer to 1 cup per 10 gal or more..but I like my bait shiny! But without a doubt salt is needed and works wonders.

Cleaner cooler water definitely helps make shad easier to keep, which is why you see me trying to get shad in numbers in February for my home tank. They're deep, poop free, and are very easy to keep. They'll live til starvation. For 1-2 day use, it doesn't really matter where you get them from.

For guys like me who don't live on the water or close by, a medium term storage plan may be required. Something that will work for 3-4 days. This is why I am interested in the chemical removal of ammonia. Using this treatment combined with my existing live well as a pre-bait tank purging system might be the ticket for longer outings and less water changes.  The live well could be the place for the initial ammonia and poo and then my seasoned bait tank could be a place for a happy medium-term home thus cutting my throws per outing down substantially.

So far my MO has been throw early, fish for 4 hours, then throw again because all my bait sucks!  

Now my plan is...throw early, fish all day, sneak into Bentrod's dock, recharge my batteries, sleep on boat, throw early...Repeat!